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	<title>Comments on: Adding location to a non GPS phone : using OpenCellID</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/</link>
	<description>8Motions news feed, informations about J2memap, and every relevant information to Mobile Mapping applications...</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jan 2009 14:39:24 +0000</pubDate>
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		<item>
		<title>By: kael</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-55186</link>
		<dc:creator>kael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 19:31:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-55186</guid>
		<description>There's a &lt;a href="http://joune.blogspot.com/2007/07/wanted-vlib-beta-testeurs.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;Vélib' midlet&lt;/a&gt; that could be extended to support OpenCellID.

I gotta get a GPS to scan Paris cell towers and participate to the OpenCellID database. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s a <a href="http://joune.blogspot.com/2007/07/wanted-vlib-beta-testeurs.html" rel="nofollow">Vélib&#8217; midlet</a> that could be extended to support OpenCellID.</p>
<p>I gotta get a GPS to scan Paris cell towers and participate to the OpenCellID database. <img src='http://blog.8motions.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: thomas.landspurg</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-55026</link>
		<dc:creator>thomas.landspurg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jul 2008 19:44:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-55026</guid>
		<description>@martynas : unfortunatly, there is no way to acccess to cell id on nokia. The only possibility for now is to create a native process, on S60, which communicate locally with the java app</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@martynas : unfortunatly, there is no way to acccess to cell id on nokia. The only possibility for now is to create a native process, on S60, which communicate locally with the java app</p>
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		<title>By: Martynas</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-55023</link>
		<dc:creator>Martynas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:02:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-55023</guid>
		<description>Thomas, isn't there a way to get cell ID in J2ME on Nokia?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thomas, isn&#8217;t there a way to get cell ID in J2ME on Nokia?</p>
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		<title>By: kael</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-54952</link>
		<dc:creator>kael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 10:47:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-54952</guid>
		<description>Regarding JSR-179, apparently &lt;i&gt;MTE_CELLID&lt;/i&gt; seems to be a constant so I'm not sure what it is used for. Could you explain how it could be used and what an external server would provide ?

Also, there seems to be several other LBS technics for mobiles like &lt;a href="http://cellulartechnologyhub.blogspot.com/2007/03/location-based-services-lbs.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;Enhanced Cell ID, Angle of Arrival (AOA) and Time of Arrival (TOA)&lt;/a&gt;, and JSR-179 seems to provide some of those data.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding JSR-179, apparently <i>MTE_CELLID</i> seems to be a constant so I&#8217;m not sure what it is used for. Could you explain how it could be used and what an external server would provide ?</p>
<p>Also, there seems to be several other LBS technics for mobiles like <a href="http://cellulartechnologyhub.blogspot.com/2007/03/location-based-services-lbs.html" rel="nofollow">Enhanced Cell ID, Angle of Arrival (AOA) and Time of Arrival (TOA)</a>, and JSR-179 seems to provide some of those data.</p>
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		<title>By: kael</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-54951</link>
		<dc:creator>kael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 10:39:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-54951</guid>
		<description>I'm just starting to learn J2ME, so I may take some time to write midlets.

Actually, I wrote a Vélib XMPP bot that I use to check where to find available places (using a geocoding API amongst other things) with &lt;a href="http://bombusmod.net.ru/" rel="nofollow"&gt;Bombus Mod&lt;/a&gt;. But to use it, I need to stop and write an address which is not very practical when riding a bike. What I'd like is to have relevant data always displayed on the mini-screen.

I have several ideas of weather forecasts, Vélib stations, FON WiFi hotspot, prices of gas stations or NAViTiA (SIEL) based midlets.

For static data, once the midlet listener get a CellID it would make a query to get and display relevant data.

For dynamic data (like from the NAViTiA or Vélib API), there should be a push mechanism which would allow to get real-time data, perhaps with XMPP Pubsub, and hence to avoid unnecessary polling requests.

For Vélib  I doubt they would deliver data in real-time, but for NAViTiA I think it might possible.

Regarding the GUI, I wished to simulate CBS with its channels subscription mechanism. But apparently, a midlet can't emulate CBS, so I'm searching for an alternative and thinking to the Nokia Themes SDK.

BTW, I tried to run a modified version of OpenCellIDTest.java for a Nokia Series 40 3rd Edition Feature Pack 1, following the &lt;a href="http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/TSJ000964_-_Series_40:_System_Properties_in_Operator_and_Manufacturer_domain" rel="nofollow"&gt;S40 system properties description&lt;/a&gt; but the values appear as "null" because the midlet requires to be signed as mentioned &lt;a href="http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/CS000947_-_Getting_Cell_ID_in_Java_ME" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;. So I either should learn to sign midlets or a get a S60 mobile.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m just starting to learn J2ME, so I may take some time to write midlets.</p>
<p>Actually, I wrote a Vélib XMPP bot that I use to check where to find available places (using a geocoding API amongst other things) with <a href="http://bombusmod.net.ru/" rel="nofollow">Bombus Mod</a>. But to use it, I need to stop and write an address which is not very practical when riding a bike. What I&#8217;d like is to have relevant data always displayed on the mini-screen.</p>
<p>I have several ideas of weather forecasts, Vélib stations, FON WiFi hotspot, prices of gas stations or NAViTiA (SIEL) based midlets.</p>
<p>For static data, once the midlet listener get a CellID it would make a query to get and display relevant data.</p>
<p>For dynamic data (like from the NAViTiA or Vélib API), there should be a push mechanism which would allow to get real-time data, perhaps with XMPP Pubsub, and hence to avoid unnecessary polling requests.</p>
<p>For Vélib  I doubt they would deliver data in real-time, but for NAViTiA I think it might possible.</p>
<p>Regarding the GUI, I wished to simulate CBS with its channels subscription mechanism. But apparently, a midlet can&#8217;t emulate CBS, so I&#8217;m searching for an alternative and thinking to the Nokia Themes SDK.</p>
<p>BTW, I tried to run a modified version of OpenCellIDTest.java for a Nokia Series 40 3rd Edition Feature Pack 1, following the <a href="http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/TSJ000964_-_Series_40:_System_Properties_in_Operator_and_Manufacturer_domain" rel="nofollow">S40 system properties description</a> but the values appear as &#8220;null&#8221; because the midlet requires to be signed as mentioned <a href="http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/CS000947_-_Getting_Cell_ID_in_Java_ME" rel="nofollow">here</a>. So I either should learn to sign midlets or a get a S60 mobile.</p>
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		<title>By: thomas.landspurg</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-54887</link>
		<dc:creator>thomas.landspurg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 12:12:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-54887</guid>
		<description>@kael: Going back to your previous post, about JSR179: the issue with JSR179 proividing support for CellID, is that the CellID is hidden, and require access to an external server (OpenCellID could provide it). Very few handset have implemented this, as far as I know...

But your idea of providing home screen with information is nice...It could be possible to do it with SonyEricsson too, as it's one of the few handsets which allows j2me app to run as background, in the idle screen.

You can easily do an app to display location based information! And to be honest, this is a very smart idea, I like it! Do you have plans to works on this?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@kael: Going back to your previous post, about JSR179: the issue with JSR179 proividing support for CellID, is that the CellID is hidden, and require access to an external server (OpenCellID could provide it). Very few handset have implemented this, as far as I know&#8230;</p>
<p>But your idea of providing home screen with information is nice&#8230;It could be possible to do it with SonyEricsson too, as it&#8217;s one of the few handsets which allows j2me app to run as background, in the idle screen.</p>
<p>You can easily do an app to display location based information! And to be honest, this is a very smart idea, I like it! Do you have plans to works on this?</p>
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		<title>By: thomas.landspurg</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-54886</link>
		<dc:creator>thomas.landspurg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 12:07:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-54886</guid>
		<description>@kael : cazn you be more precise...Are you asking for an evolution of the location program? I will soon post a sample where background is displayed using OpenStreetMap, so I hope it will help you.
  Regards</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@kael : cazn you be more precise&#8230;Are you asking for an evolution of the location program? I will soon post a sample where background is displayed using OpenStreetMap, so I hope it will help you.<br />
  Regards</p>
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		<title>By: kael</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-54883</link>
		<dc:creator>kael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 07:27:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-54883</guid>
		<description>Addendum : if it was possible, a SVG map could be displayed as a background screen and metadata as text.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Addendum : if it was possible, a SVG map could be displayed as a background screen and metadata as text.</p>
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		<title>By: kael</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-54882</link>
		<dc:creator>kael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 07:24:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-54882</guid>
		<description>I came across this &lt;a href="http://discussion.forum.nokia.com/forum/showthread.php?s=e38e157d1193b8ebf20ba1a8378a28bf&#38;p=315926#post315926" rel="nofollow"&gt;thread&lt;/a&gt; and discovered that &lt;a href="http://www.forum.nokia.com/document/Java_Developers_Library_v2/GUID-4AEC8DAF-DDCC-4A30-B820-23F2BA60EA52/javax/microedition/location/Location.html#MTE_CELLID" rel="nofollow"&gt;JSR-179 does support CellID&lt;/a&gt; :

&lt;i&gt;MTE_CELLID

public static final int MTE_CELLID

    Location method Cell-ID for cellular (in GSM, this is the same as CGI, Cell Global Identity). MTE_CELLID = 0x00000008&lt;/i&gt;

:)

BTW, I have an idea of midlets : the goal is to be able to get "subscribed channels" informations always displayed on the screen or on the mini-screen of the mobile "in a standard manner".

For example, I'd like to have always displayed the most close FON WiFi hotspot or the list of the most close Velib' stations on the screen.

I was first thinking to &lt;a href="http://www.gsmhelpdesk.nl/en/helpdesk/helpdesk.php?id=57" rel="nofollow"&gt;Cell Info Display&lt;/a&gt; that appear on the screens. But it seems not possible for a midlet to emulate Cell Broadcast informations (apparently, only emulators like the WTK can), and even less to generate specific CBS informations like Cell Info Display.

So I'm now thinking to a midlet that would use the UI API specific to each class of devices to display those informations via the screensaver or in a similar manner using the screen (themes ?) API, but I don't know if it's possible.

There are very interesting mashups to do with CellID and POI databases using the &lt;a href="http://jan.ucc.nau.edu/~cvm/latlon_formula.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;calculation of the orthodromic distance&lt;/a&gt;, though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I came across this <a href="http://discussion.forum.nokia.com/forum/showthread.php?s=e38e157d1193b8ebf20ba1a8378a28bf&amp;p=315926#post315926" rel="nofollow">thread</a> and discovered that <a href="http://www.forum.nokia.com/document/Java_Developers_Library_v2/GUID-4AEC8DAF-DDCC-4A30-B820-23F2BA60EA52/javax/microedition/location/Location.html#MTE_CELLID" rel="nofollow">JSR-179 does support CellID</a> :</p>
<p><i>MTE_CELLID</p>
<p>public static final int MTE_CELLID</p>
<p>    Location method Cell-ID for cellular (in GSM, this is the same as CGI, Cell Global Identity). MTE_CELLID = 0&#215;00000008</i></p>
<p> <img src='http://blog.8motions.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>BTW, I have an idea of midlets : the goal is to be able to get &#8220;subscribed channels&#8221; informations always displayed on the screen or on the mini-screen of the mobile &#8220;in a standard manner&#8221;.</p>
<p>For example, I&#8217;d like to have always displayed the most close FON WiFi hotspot or the list of the most close Velib&#8217; stations on the screen.</p>
<p>I was first thinking to <a href="http://www.gsmhelpdesk.nl/en/helpdesk/helpdesk.php?id=57" rel="nofollow">Cell Info Display</a> that appear on the screens. But it seems not possible for a midlet to emulate Cell Broadcast informations (apparently, only emulators like the WTK can), and even less to generate specific CBS informations like Cell Info Display.</p>
<p>So I&#8217;m now thinking to a midlet that would use the UI API specific to each class of devices to display those informations via the screensaver or in a similar manner using the screen (themes ?) API, but I don&#8217;t know if it&#8217;s possible.</p>
<p>There are very interesting mashups to do with CellID and POI databases using the <a href="http://jan.ucc.nau.edu/~cvm/latlon_formula.html" rel="nofollow">calculation of the orthodromic distance</a>, though.</p>
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		<title>By: thomas.landspurg</title>
		<link>http://blog.8motions.com/2008/06/26/adding-location-to-a-non-gps-phone-using-opencellid/comment-page-1/#comment-54755</link>
		<dc:creator>thomas.landspurg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 20:15:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.8motions.com/?p=83#comment-54755</guid>
		<description>@kael, no JSR179 does not provides direct access to CellID, even if it could be theorically used or this.... Today, CellID are provided through specific properties and are unfortunately not standardized.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@kael, no JSR179 does not provides direct access to CellID, even if it could be theorically used or this&#8230;. Today, CellID are provided through specific properties and are unfortunately not standardized.</p>
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